When you have a nation with this unhealthy, over-the-top patriotism, where they see themselves as almost divinely chosen, a shining beacon, the biggest, the best, blah blah blah, mixed with insane inequality, a downright inhumane system, and a weird obsession with guns, it’s a recipe for disaster. America is full of decent people, but it’s never really figured out how to build a decent society.
From a global perspective, the big decay of the U.S. began in 2001. What is happening now is the result of a series of events that have already taken place. Nothing occurs in a vacuum. Putin invaded Georgia in 2008 after witnessing the U.S. carry out a similar action in Iraq just a few years earlier. The war in Ukraine can be seen as an escalation of that dynamic. Now the U.S. is going full bunker mode, taking whatever it believes is theirs. The significance of 9/11 cannot be underestimated. It marked the beginning of internal unrest that gradually spilled out into the world. It also represented the peak of American power.
The immediate terror and shock from the attacks were significant, but they were not the main or lasting effect. The long-term consequences, including political division, mistrust, and societal polarization, came from how society responded, from the decisions we made, the leaders we elected, and the conflicts we allowed to grow. Osama Bin Laden’s broader goal was not just to kill people, but to weaken the U.S. internally by creating division, chaos, and loss of trust. In a sense, society unintentionally helped achieve that goal through its own actions after the attacks.
In the end, Bin Laden won.
wutareyousomekinda on
For all intents and purposes: Always have been.
80 years of printing money to pay your weapons shareholders for bombs to drop so they can reinvest in the aftermath is no different than what’s happened here, except that the post-WW2 situation has evolved such that our ruling class is more timid nowadays, looking inward to exploit us and increasingly hungry for low hanging fruit.
That was after WW2, which was facilitated by the wealthy business elites of the US and UK at the time who buddied up to Hitler, got him diplomatic cover and favorable press in the NYT and papers of record. Some like Henry Ford were on board enough to publish The International Jew and build their war machines, some like JD Rockefeller were just fans of fascism and continued shipping oil thru the eve of Pearl Harbor + entire tankers of the chemicals to synthesize their fuel after the British blockade became effective, some like Leslie Urquhart had lost out on collectivism in the new Soviet Union, while others like Prescott Bush just wanted to make money off of the war and money printer.
The pre-WW2 period being no better, we invaded about 30 other nations including Nicaragua 11 times before there was a Soviet Union, so obviously that had nothing to do with it. Before that we industrialized on the backs of plantation slavery, and the proceeds of our elites’ opium trafficking which built the Lowell plants and academic institutions including Harvard and Yale which pumped out the likes of Dick Cheney and the later Bushes. All settled atop the largest genocide in history of the Native Americans.
Maleficent_Tank2199 on
Tbh the only difference is that Trump no longer cares to pretend.
If you look at US involvement since WW2 you need to be particularly ignorant to paint the US as the good guys.
Sincere greetings from your new old adversaries in Germany
Dangerous_Thought666 on
Always have been
miksa668 on
Only now?
illo79 on
„now“
Counterpoint-4 on
I wonder what else Putin has told Trump to do?
Sculptor_of_man on
Always have been
hagrid2018 on
The US always had the best PR team, so the thuggery has never been as obvious as the orange clown and his cronies.
Scared-Room-9962 on
Now?
Ask the people of the countries you’ve destroyed over the years how long you’ve been the bad guys for.
It’s becoming nakedly apparent now because you are talking about attacking Europe.
thrawtes on
“America was always bad” comments are nonsense in an attempt to self-soothe for the modern rise of fascism.
America was always America. Like any country with power it has many atrocities in its history, but it also has genuinely contributed a lot of good to the world. The value of the rules-based international order that has held off another World War for nearly 100 years can’t be understated.
America recently made the decision to doom tens of millions of innocent people to death by ending aid efforts. You can’t doom tens of millions of people to death if you didn’t previously have a program to save tens of millions of people.
American has been better and can be better, don’t let anyone tell you it has to be this way. They’re just trying to get you to accept the current state of things as inevitable.
Ok_Will6649 on
“Now” Did you guys think you were the good guys pre Trump?
HDRsoul on
We suck.
Professional-Sea2875 on
I’ll be honest, seeing some of the commentary on here, obviously the MAGA / conservatives are masturbating in their own grim psychopathy, but on the other side, you seem more focussed on the rest of the world dealing with the problems that you (the people of the US) have created. Pretty much no talk about mass protests (granted the ‘no kings’ protests were a great start, but, like there’s been ?2). No talk of general strikes. No calls to influence your representatives etc etc. Lots of excuses. Lots of “why don’t the Europeans stop us” etc.
Perhaps you don’t deserve your democracy? You don’t seem to care for it.
jrizzle86 on
Now????
NaughtNymphh on
Actually, been the bad guys since 2016 but the credits keep rolling somehow, tsk
Agitated-Fee3598 on
Partially thanks to the fuckers at the bulwark
Healthy-Business9465 on
We no longer get to judge average Germans during Nazi Germany.
Unique_Ranger2426 on
“Now”
theguy1336 on
Now? Please. The US has been a cancer on Earth for longer than I’ve been alive.
EldritchSlut on
Always have been.
Carl-99999 on
This will stay true until AOC is president.
Legitimate-Bed1591 on
As I said in a previous comment, about to cut ties with the US [business] on the basis of his Greenland comments.
Figure it out guys. Time’s running out for your country, fast.
I know you didn’t ask for the problem but it is your job, now, to fix it.
Gardening_investor on
Voted for someone that said they’d be a dictator, yet shocked he’s a dictator?
paris86 on
wdym “now”
KissyKittenzz on
Sometimes it feels like, we literally coup’n countries for sport and still lose the olympics, fucking embarrassing
Conscious-Story-7579 on
Golden scapegoat
bjbinc on
Insert astronaut shooting astronaut in the back meme
DeterminedErmine on
Always have been, you just had better PR
Ectier on
Every country has its flaws and bloody history that is utterly true, no nation is built on flowers and good will.
Post WW2 however America shifted its role to becoming the worlds biggest narcissitic bully, stockpiling arms and fighting communisim. As others pointed out the extreme patriotisim America has had has proven to be a detriment. Which to a degree warped a lot of its own populations views into thinking America is the worlds main character. That it is the greatest country in the world and that the American way is the way of freedom and the rest of the world should follow it. While America have been the bad guys for some time, its never felt quite as dire as it is today.
People tell a lot of us Non americans to stop watching or commenting on your politics or your country. Its hard to avoid watching on in horror when one wrong person in charge of a country that has a massive stockpile of weapons could start a world breaking conflict. Whose values and advancements have helped shape western culture as we know it. I sincerely hope America can go back from this road but it is seeming like history repeats itself and the country will cannabilise itself
Admiral_Eversor on
Always have been. The mask is just a bit more off than usual.
No_Collection1870 on
And have been for far longer than anybody wants or desires
pan7h- on
not “now” since 2001
Lord_Hitachi on
Same as it ever was
steepleton on
the problem with america is that it’s wars don’t touch it’s mainland.
europeans understand bombs and death.
america walks around like a rich kid that’s never had the humility that a good square punch in the nose brings you
ferris2 on
Yeah, you’re not a trustworthy ally at all.
FootCheeseParmesan on
You always have been. WW2 was a cynical blip.
Far_Section3715 on
Now?!
Drunken_Hillbilly on
We’ve been the bad guys for a lot longer than people think.
earhere on
America was always the bad guys. The country was founded as a settler colonial entity built on genocide and slavery, all so wealthy landowners could be kings themselves.
MattMcdoodle on
They have been scummy for years, it is only now they are honest about it. We all know they survive on oil wars, weapons trade and on the costs of it’s workingclass. We know they spied on their own without their consent in secret, we know the warcrimes they have commited and we know of the drug trades they made to fund their operations. Both the United states goverment and the Russian goverment are warmongering nations that dictate against democracy and will stomp out it’s own people if it would benefit them
No-Discussion-8510 on
Always were lmao
Mayataua on
No matter what, I’m not letting a single person I know personally that supported, still supports, or praises trump forget about it. I’m done with the “Oh, just be glad they saw the light and changed sides” or whatever. Fuck that. They are goddamn adults that saw the exact same thing we ALL saw. He was a rapist, liar, con man, corrupt to the core piece of shit and they still supported him. They made their little fascist bed and they can lie in it til the sun sets forever. Fuck those people and fuck trump.
Budget_Operation_106 on
Now? Since post WW2 the US has been the single biggest bad guy in the world.
Muldrex on
Biden put a 25 Million dollar bounty on Maduro in 2024
Dat_Harass on
You guys remember Iran-contra, or… it’s a long list is all I’m saying. A lot of people will make the case for meddling in the world being okay but I’m going to guess it’s more or less always been about business and money.
That isn’t good guys.
Lovestripes on
You’re late to the party if you’re only just realising this.
Listening_Heads on
If youre black or gay it has been the whole time
fongsaiyuk on
Is this not the direct cause of capitalism? We are country driven by greed and not morals. There is no honor anymore in politics. It’s not about helping your people or your constituents, it’s about securing raw materials around the world to help businesses and the war machine to continue dominance.
49 Comments
When you have a nation with this unhealthy, over-the-top patriotism, where they see themselves as almost divinely chosen, a shining beacon, the biggest, the best, blah blah blah, mixed with insane inequality, a downright inhumane system, and a weird obsession with guns, it’s a recipe for disaster. America is full of decent people, but it’s never really figured out how to build a decent society.
From a global perspective, the big decay of the U.S. began in 2001. What is happening now is the result of a series of events that have already taken place. Nothing occurs in a vacuum. Putin invaded Georgia in 2008 after witnessing the U.S. carry out a similar action in Iraq just a few years earlier. The war in Ukraine can be seen as an escalation of that dynamic. Now the U.S. is going full bunker mode, taking whatever it believes is theirs. The significance of 9/11 cannot be underestimated. It marked the beginning of internal unrest that gradually spilled out into the world. It also represented the peak of American power.
The immediate terror and shock from the attacks were significant, but they were not the main or lasting effect. The long-term consequences, including political division, mistrust, and societal polarization, came from how society responded, from the decisions we made, the leaders we elected, and the conflicts we allowed to grow. Osama Bin Laden’s broader goal was not just to kill people, but to weaken the U.S. internally by creating division, chaos, and loss of trust. In a sense, society unintentionally helped achieve that goal through its own actions after the attacks.
In the end, Bin Laden won.
For all intents and purposes: Always have been.
80 years of printing money to pay your weapons shareholders for bombs to drop so they can reinvest in the aftermath is no different than what’s happened here, except that the post-WW2 situation has evolved such that our ruling class is more timid nowadays, looking inward to exploit us and increasingly hungry for low hanging fruit.
That was after WW2, which was facilitated by the wealthy business elites of the US and UK at the time who buddied up to Hitler, got him diplomatic cover and favorable press in the NYT and papers of record. Some like Henry Ford were on board enough to publish The International Jew and build their war machines, some like JD Rockefeller were just fans of fascism and continued shipping oil thru the eve of Pearl Harbor + entire tankers of the chemicals to synthesize their fuel after the British blockade became effective, some like Leslie Urquhart had lost out on collectivism in the new Soviet Union, while others like Prescott Bush just wanted to make money off of the war and money printer.
The pre-WW2 period being no better, we invaded about 30 other nations including Nicaragua 11 times before there was a Soviet Union, so obviously that had nothing to do with it. Before that we industrialized on the backs of plantation slavery, and the proceeds of our elites’ opium trafficking which built the Lowell plants and academic institutions including Harvard and Yale which pumped out the likes of Dick Cheney and the later Bushes. All settled atop the largest genocide in history of the Native Americans.
Tbh the only difference is that Trump no longer cares to pretend.
If you look at US involvement since WW2 you need to be particularly ignorant to paint the US as the good guys.
Sincere greetings from your new old adversaries in Germany
Always have been
Only now?
„now“
I wonder what else Putin has told Trump to do?
Always have been
The US always had the best PR team, so the thuggery has never been as obvious as the orange clown and his cronies.
Now?
Ask the people of the countries you’ve destroyed over the years how long you’ve been the bad guys for.
It’s becoming nakedly apparent now because you are talking about attacking Europe.
“America was always bad” comments are nonsense in an attempt to self-soothe for the modern rise of fascism.
America was always America. Like any country with power it has many atrocities in its history, but it also has genuinely contributed a lot of good to the world. The value of the rules-based international order that has held off another World War for nearly 100 years can’t be understated.
America recently made the decision to doom tens of millions of innocent people to death by ending aid efforts. You can’t doom tens of millions of people to death if you didn’t previously have a program to save tens of millions of people.
American has been better and can be better, don’t let anyone tell you it has to be this way. They’re just trying to get you to accept the current state of things as inevitable.
“Now” Did you guys think you were the good guys pre Trump?
We suck.
I’ll be honest, seeing some of the commentary on here, obviously the MAGA / conservatives are masturbating in their own grim psychopathy, but on the other side, you seem more focussed on the rest of the world dealing with the problems that you (the people of the US) have created. Pretty much no talk about mass protests (granted the ‘no kings’ protests were a great start, but, like there’s been ?2). No talk of general strikes. No calls to influence your representatives etc etc. Lots of excuses. Lots of “why don’t the Europeans stop us” etc.
Perhaps you don’t deserve your democracy? You don’t seem to care for it.
Now????
Actually, been the bad guys since 2016 but the credits keep rolling somehow, tsk
Partially thanks to the fuckers at the bulwark
We no longer get to judge average Germans during Nazi Germany.
“Now”
Now? Please. The US has been a cancer on Earth for longer than I’ve been alive.
Always have been.
This will stay true until AOC is president.
As I said in a previous comment, about to cut ties with the US [business] on the basis of his Greenland comments.
Figure it out guys. Time’s running out for your country, fast.
I know you didn’t ask for the problem but it is your job, now, to fix it.
Voted for someone that said they’d be a dictator, yet shocked he’s a dictator?
wdym “now”
Sometimes it feels like, we literally coup’n countries for sport and still lose the olympics, fucking embarrassing
Golden scapegoat
Insert astronaut shooting astronaut in the back meme
Always have been, you just had better PR
Every country has its flaws and bloody history that is utterly true, no nation is built on flowers and good will.
Post WW2 however America shifted its role to becoming the worlds biggest narcissitic bully, stockpiling arms and fighting communisim. As others pointed out the extreme patriotisim America has had has proven to be a detriment. Which to a degree warped a lot of its own populations views into thinking America is the worlds main character. That it is the greatest country in the world and that the American way is the way of freedom and the rest of the world should follow it. While America have been the bad guys for some time, its never felt quite as dire as it is today.
People tell a lot of us Non americans to stop watching or commenting on your politics or your country. Its hard to avoid watching on in horror when one wrong person in charge of a country that has a massive stockpile of weapons could start a world breaking conflict. Whose values and advancements have helped shape western culture as we know it. I sincerely hope America can go back from this road but it is seeming like history repeats itself and the country will cannabilise itself
Always have been. The mask is just a bit more off than usual.
And have been for far longer than anybody wants or desires
not “now” since 2001
Same as it ever was
the problem with america is that it’s wars don’t touch it’s mainland.
europeans understand bombs and death.
america walks around like a rich kid that’s never had the humility that a good square punch in the nose brings you
Yeah, you’re not a trustworthy ally at all.
You always have been. WW2 was a cynical blip.
Now?!
We’ve been the bad guys for a lot longer than people think.
America was always the bad guys. The country was founded as a settler colonial entity built on genocide and slavery, all so wealthy landowners could be kings themselves.
They have been scummy for years, it is only now they are honest about it. We all know they survive on oil wars, weapons trade and on the costs of it’s workingclass. We know they spied on their own without their consent in secret, we know the warcrimes they have commited and we know of the drug trades they made to fund their operations. Both the United states goverment and the Russian goverment are warmongering nations that dictate against democracy and will stomp out it’s own people if it would benefit them
Always were lmao
No matter what, I’m not letting a single person I know personally that supported, still supports, or praises trump forget about it. I’m done with the “Oh, just be glad they saw the light and changed sides” or whatever. Fuck that. They are goddamn adults that saw the exact same thing we ALL saw. He was a rapist, liar, con man, corrupt to the core piece of shit and they still supported him. They made their little fascist bed and they can lie in it til the sun sets forever. Fuck those people and fuck trump.
Now? Since post WW2 the US has been the single biggest bad guy in the world.
Biden put a 25 Million dollar bounty on Maduro in 2024
You guys remember Iran-contra, or… it’s a long list is all I’m saying. A lot of people will make the case for meddling in the world being okay but I’m going to guess it’s more or less always been about business and money.
That isn’t good guys.
You’re late to the party if you’re only just realising this.
If youre black or gay it has been the whole time
Is this not the direct cause of capitalism? We are country driven by greed and not morals. There is no honor anymore in politics. It’s not about helping your people or your constituents, it’s about securing raw materials around the world to help businesses and the war machine to continue dominance.